Reductio ad Europe…

(The following conversation took place about an hour ago.  I have not recalled it with word for word accuracy, but what I present here, captures the essence.)

I was a part of a conversation pertaining to morality and whether moral actions could be criticized from an objective standpoint or if such criticism was impossible in light of the subjective situation of all humans.  In short: the age-old debate over the objective or subjective nature of morality.

I’m resigned to the fact that we’re all a bunch of monkeys flinging poo at each other” said one young lady, whose cynicism made her slightly less attractive than she was otherwise.  The moral dispositions of a monkey are nothing to take seriously, afterall.

My years of Christian apologetics had prepared me for this.  The correct response would be to reduce her position to absurdity (reductio ad absurdum) by demonstrating that ‘subjective morality’ is an incoherent concept and that no one could possibly live that way.  To show her, in fact, that those who claim to believe in ‘subjective morality’ do not live as if they believe it at all!   Their actions in life contradict their philosophical profession!  (As an aside:  This method is really an ad-hominem appeal, although arguably non-fallacious.)  Then I would demonstrate that there is an objective right and objective wrong in the world such that, even the actions of animals could be judged!

But, just before speaking…something happened to me.

If the reader will pardon a bit of hyperbole, (such is necessary in this case), I believe I heard, off in the distance, the sound of a drum.  The Young Drummer, on his quest up the glass mountain, drumming away, sent forth his rhythm echoing across the mountains of old Europe, through the ships of the American pioneers, around the Appalachians and through the hearts of my ancestors where it reached my ear, just for this moment…

I became infuriated that a daughter of Eve so despised herself and her race that she would cynically refer to herself as a poo-slinging primate with no glory…no vision… no concept of the greatness inherent in the desire to rebuild Jerusalem!   I wasn’t upset with her, I felt sad for her.  I was angry as Hell at the social conventions that had so-captured her proud spirit!

Don’t you, for just a moment, wonder what the knight thinks about your words?”  I asked her.

The buzz around us stopped and everyone listened in.  It was novel.  Someone was actually talking, and not just pontificating:

Just for a second, think of how virtuous and wonderful it is to stand, back to the wall, against overwhelming odds, armed only with a sword and a fierce desire to guard the honor of your ancestors by dying for principles that had been given to you by God Himself!  Oh what a fight!  Oh what a stand!

How must Jane Austin think of your words? (I interjected this here, because most white girls have a sort of odd respect for European literature and are not wont to callously dismiss it.) How would Charles Dickens feel to know that we’re all irrelevant and comical creatures, flinging poo at each other?  How would Sir Walter Scott feel about that?

No, I don’t think that’s what you believe at all.  I think you know, deep down, your own worth.  You know who you are and what is to be expected of you!  You know who you are, every bit as much as the princess knows who she is and how she is to be treated by the knight!

You need a princess…you need that knight.  Once you meet them, you’ll not shrug off proper affections or scorn noble acts of honor.”

Her cynical mask fell away and I saw, behind it, a vulnerable woman who needed the very thing I had described.  She admitted that, “on second thought, there must be something to nobility afterall.  Maybe heroism can be meaningful?

Our people are captured by false doctrines, but many retain their natural affections, even if deeply buried and kept out of sight.

But no heart-cell mutes the sound of drums completely.

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14 Responses to Reductio ad Europe…

  1. Jenai Carolina says:

    Beautiful words indeed! I dare say that your encouraging words are an exquisite example of God’s love for her speaking through you at the prompting of the Holy Spirit – albeit via the sound of a drumbeat. The natural tendency to refute and argue against her point would have painfully been remembered by her as actually proving her point. May God be her Loving Knight who brings to light the meaning and purpose currently hidden in her life. May God also use you to share His boundless love with others – even amidst the poo-slinging! ;-)

  2. Shotgun says:

    Thanks for the kind words!

    Interestingly enough, I’ve presented the moral argument time and time again…over and over, I’ve had this argument with people, and never once have I had the sort of result that I had when I argued as I described above.

    Not only did she ‘get on board’ with what I was saying, she did so immediately, and the other people standing around did as well!

    It was really amazing.

  3. Jenai Carolina says:

    God’s love IS amazing!

    Despite knowing all our flaws, sins & tendencies to want to run away from Him, — and knowing the perfect reasons, arguments & rationales against our ravished worldviews & mindsets, He *still* goes out of His way to protect our injured sense of self-worth as He lovingly & gently picks us up out of the poo.

    That’s the true definition of “meekness” – power under the submission of love!

    Thank you for demonstrating God’s loving meekness to her – and us!

    Blessed are the meek for they will inherit the earth!
    Shotgun, enjoy the earth (power/resources) you have been given – He will use you to govern them wisely!

    Blessings my brother,
    Jenai Carolina

  4. Frank says:

    I’ve had this conversation numerous times. Usually I lose.

    Many racialists value Darwinism because the theory makes differences among the races likely (e.g. intelligent races evolving out of lesser ones). Lately they’ve embraced Frank Salter’s strange EGI instead of more natural nationalism. They seem to believe that anything that serves whites is moral because all of life is a battle of genetics.

    However, if life is merely a struggle that gives rise to evolution, then it’s natural to take a more “cosmotheist” (wiki it if curious) view that man is meant to evolve into a god, such progress ultimately falls to relativity but apparently that doesn’t matter since within pure materialism nothing matters. Another value of theirs seems to be that man enjoys creating – this is apparently part of ascending to godhood, being a creator who acts (Nietzschean will) on his environment rather than being a “slave” to what came before.

    So… these same “racialists” go and embrace wild eugenicist ideologies – desiring to use biotech to transcend the white race.

    Ironically then the very people who began as racialists rejecting faith, because they believe Darwinism better defends race, now themselves threaten race! They now desire to “transcend” not only the white race but humanity as well, and this technology is developing, albeit slowly.

    Materialism simply cannot defend anything material.

  5. Frank says:

    A similar component is this strange cult of elitism that’s arisen. Since the degenerate society around us is egalitarian and possessed by a strange “irrational” cult-like set of values called liberalism, elitism and materialist reason are embraced in reaction. And similarly Islam and modern anti-white Christianity are rejected in favour of the cult of reason.

    I’m very much an elitist, it’s absurd not to be one; but classically an elite is meant to serve the whole, including not only the living but ancestors and the as yet unborn. Though apparently “serving” anything makes one a “slave”. The word “aristocrat” is rewritten by the damned Nietzsche to mean an impious brat who only “exerts his will” on his environment… Similarly Strauss seems to be a materialist but to preach the usefulness of “creating” delusions for others to believe in (e.g. the war on terror).

    And of course there’s a Christian defence of elitism, but I’ve been driven myself into using the pagan classics since the materialists are often so strongly anti-Christian.

    Reg, having conversations: I hope these two posts haven’t been too preachy. Feel free to delete them if unwanted for any reason. (I was addressing only you, so if deleted I’ll assume they were first read.)

  6. shotgunwildatheart says:

    Hey Frank,

    It’s rare that any post gets deleted here, especially ones of your depth. I appreciate the insights.

    I’d be interested in learning more about Frank Salters’ ‘EGI.’ I’m not experienced at talking with the pagan white nationalists at all and I’m unfamiliar with their thinking. (When they start talking about Odin and eugenics, I just zone out.)

    I’ve thought of going to Stormfront and wading in, just to get that experience.

    It’s interesting that you make a connection between the PWNs and the “liberals” of today. Cornelius Van Til talks about the “descent into the void” where man rejects God’s order in favor of constructing his own fiat-reality.

    I wrote a blog awhile back (when the J. Craig Venter institute supposedly created life in the lab) that tried to show how men were using science as a tool to carry out this “descent into the void.”

    Michael Hoffman, (conspiracy theorist and scholar) harps on the theme of cyborgs and abuses of bio-technology in his book “Secret Societies and Psychological Warfare.” It’s sometimes hard to wade around his language, but I interpreted him to mean something roughly the same: that man is seeking to be a god while turning himself into a monster.

  7. Frank says:

    “Pagans” can be divided into three groups: the pious, the fuzzy, and the impious.

    The former revere their ancestors, are inclined to respect ancestral traditions, and are apt to hold certain things sacred due to a rough belief in God or gods. Ironically, they don’t seem to actually believe in their official gods, though there seems to be a vague belief in God / gods regardless. I see this as the Holy Spirit at work within them. When faux-Christian leaders take part in leading the charge against the West, it’s expected that pious men will look to other gods. I suspect many will convert to Christianity later in life as the truth becomes clear to them.

    The second group: many “pagans” fall in between with a fuzzy, undefined feeling which leaves them open to influence by those with clear content, Richard Weaver’s moral guiding center. Among the fuzzies are a group who defend their EGI, which is an attempt at Darwinian nationalism. EGI was developed by Frank Salter in a book. It’s good in how it grants a “rational” defence to nationalism, but it’s bad as a competitor of true nationalism which is a much more powerful force.

    The latter are materialists – pure impious nihilists. They are very much working towards a “descent into the void”. At the extreme, they embrace a variety of related philosophies including cosmotheism and a sort of Promethean desire to “create”. However, if directing genetics and denying God and tradition; where does authority come from? All sources have been exhausted, leaving only madness.

    You could look at it like this: Marxism’s ultimate goal was to destroy religion and nationalism, freeing man to live only by reason. The right used to speak of studying Marxists to learn their secrets, and it appears the right has been largely overwhelmed by the Marxist’s superior spirit… It now continues as an enemy within, undermining the right from its very core. This is similar to how the neocons captured and then booted out the real old right in the US.

    I’ve been intending to read more paganism simply to learn of the authentic spirit. I’ve found some authorities defending my case and very little supporting the nihilists, though as Evola noted “neo-paganism” is usually not authentic – better understood as anti-Christianity than true paganism, which scarcely remains. Most, if not all other, kinists do not share my interest in paganism in the least; but for as long as Christianity is at war with Europe, the pious will continue to turn to paganism.

    “I wrote a blog awhile back”

    I’m not surprised. The ironically simple-minded IQ-obsessives assume their high reason will grant them the answer to all things. However, it seems to mostly only be true Christians who readily grasp the moral implications.

    I saw the problem on my own after only finding a GM fish for sale when a student, and I’m approx. the same age as you. I’ve talked with a number of intelligent atheist WN however who seem to find this all fascinating.

  8. Frank says:

    More EGI discussion & also.

    Another facet is how ideologies tend to serve the interests of those who take them up. You could think of it as golden calves who are worshiped because they grant favours.

    For a relatively pure nationalist, tradition and race serve well.

    However for an immigrant, even a “white” immigrant; he’s excluded somewhat from the core of his new nation. His ancestors do not trace into the founding stock, so he’s less apt to revere them. Nevertheless he’s taken within the open “white” society as a member, the rest oblivious that his identity remains somewhat as an outsider.

    What could readily be seen as best serving his interests as a high quality individual is a eugenic orientation that derides tradition and the past.

    So, American whites are very susceptible to transhumanism when such writers protest all the things in American society that work against them.

    Ancestral traditions:

    For many generations, as long as the divine nature lasted in them”

    Nor when the Gods of his far-off land
    Shall repossess his blood.”

    it is ludicrous to call it patriotism, or invoke the ancient deities of the hearth and the river and the hill”

    he that foments civil discord is a clanless, hearthless outlaw.”

    I could actually continue this list and similarly on the other things mentioned… Eventually I’ll have a little website up.

    And I don’t wish to encourage the worshiping of golden calves. If this giant calf is first melted down, I’ll happily partake in melting (albeit not erasing) the others, helping to further that all worship, including all nationalities, is towards God.

    What’s taking place right now among Christians is the melting of the lesser calves and very little towards the much greater calf. We tolerate atheists, but we harass pagans, though indeed I wouldn’t tolerate some sort of pagan temple being built nearby, though too I wouldn’t tolerate a temple built to Reason either.

  9. shotgunwildatheart says:

    Hey, I apologize Frank, but for some reason my spam filter caught your last comment (I think it’s the links that did it?)

    I happened to glance through the spam folder today, and caught it, else it would have been posted long sense.

    I appreciate the links. As a racially self-conscious Christian, I’ve often expressed my frustration at the way I’m damned to Hell publicly and swiftly by other Christians, and yet, they talk comfortably and freely with all sorts of Atheist blasphemers, Muslims, Mormons and the like.

    One wonders who their real god is?

  10. Frank says:

    Oh, I knew it was in the spam filter. I’d just assumed it was accidentally deleted, which would’ve been fine (it’s nothing special).

    Btw, if you ever run into a pagan, this is a good thing to deconstruct him with, eh eh:

    One should consider, then, that “paganism” is a fundamentally tendentious and artificial concept that scarcely corresponds to the historical reality of what the pre-Christian world always was in its normal manifestations, apart from a few decadent elements and aspects that derived from the degenerate remains of older cultures.

    Once we are clear about this, we come today to a paradoxical realization: that this imaginary paganism that never existed, but was invented by Christian apologists, is now serving as the starting-point for certain so-called pagan circles, and is thus threatening for the first time in history to become a reality–no more and no less than that.

    Evola.

    Basically, what we have today is a sort of golem, much worse than what the pagans of old believed in (mostly).

    “my frustration at the way I’m damned to Hell publicly and swiftly by other Christians, and yet, they talk comfortably and freely with all sorts of Atheist blasphemers, Muslims, Mormons and the like. ”

    Aye, and you can toss most of the neopagans in with that lot. Christians tend to dislike the northern pagans because of history, but they’d mesh well with the values at least.

    I tend to sit around in the WN / racial camp, heh; so they’re whom I’m familiar with battling. For a time I was warring with libertarians all day, now it’s Nietzschean neopagans.

  11. Frank says:

    I meant to say “modern Christians” would mesh well with the degenerate neopagans.

    Both of them love globalism, and the Christians increasingly tolerate sexual degeneracy.

  12. Frank says:

    Dr. Gottfried says PC is the religion of the “post-Christian West” taught inside and outside the churches.

  13. thewhitechrist says:

    May I be so bold and say that this article is on a par with Cambria will not yield’s Columns?

    I really liked it. It not only spoke to me, it taught me. Thanks

  14. Shotgun says:

    That is one heck of a compliment. (Both the idea that my mutterings might compare with Mr. Cambria, and that I’ve taught Fr. John something!)

    I can’t underscore enough my debt to Mr. Cambria. As well, the White Christ has been monumental in helping expand my view of what’s going on in the world.

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